Post by Allyn on Dec 1, 2009 8:36:23 GMT -5
I read through the entire thread again. Great study.
I may have missed this somewhere in this study so if I'm repeating what someone else said, sorry.
In 2 Timothy 1: 8-10 it says,
Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
If it can be established, or already has been, that in verse 10 the word "death" means "sleep, soul sleep, unconscious state of rest, sleep in the dust of the earth, ., then would that mean that there isn't any "ultimate termination" of the spirit of man ever? No one will sleep forever anymore. Even unbelievers? If that is true, then, I guess wouldn't we have to believe that an unsaved man's spirit will somehow be punished?
Does that make sense? Or is this passage speaking of soul sleep or the abolishment of death for believers only?
Thanks.
Steve
Hi Steve,
My personal opinion is that Paul is bringing up to Timothy what he has already made known to the Roman Christians in Romans 8 that God who gave life back to Christ is the same power who gives life to our mortal bodies. The teaching in Romans is about the likeness we share with Christ in His death burial and resurrection once we believe. It is that likeness of His resurrection that is the life to our mortal bodies. Its not a physical likeness that we experience though but rather the putting on of Christ all believers do when being born of the water and the word.
The text reads like this:
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
Do you see the two divisions in these 3 verses of Romans 8? Basically and in my opinion (you need to study this and not take my word for it) Paul is saying that not one of those steps alone will safe you. Only all three. In otherwords he says 9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.
Paul shows the requirement of the same Spirit of Christ. And then he throws in the other full condition saying that if Christ only is in you your body is still dead but with the Spirit included then life is in us also. The Spirit that raised Christ is the same Spirit who gives life to our mortal bodies. Christ alone without the Spirit is still death, but Christ and the Spirit is life.
This may sound confusing, but it is actually my first real attempt at explaining Romans 8:9-11 along side 2 Tim 1:8-10 so I hope I haven't confused it more.
