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Post by didymus on Apr 10, 2010 12:12:41 GMT -5
My answer is, YES! Absolutely! Why? Down through history, Christians, or who the world considered Christians, have always suffered the brunt of persecutions. Do you think Jews were all that were persecuted in Germany? German Christians were too. When it comes to the United States, the first group of people they will come for are Christians. That is just the way of the world. Those that have been a student of politics for a long can see that we are in the last days of the United States. We already have a one world goverment in place, it's call the United Nations. Recent wars in the Middle East were because of the rogue Arab leaders that have no intent of buckling under the one world government. Iran is next. Eventhough they are far from having a nuclear bomb, we are being told they are very close to have one. And, so what. The United States has a thousand nuclear warheads. Even if Iran did have one, what threat would they be to anyone? And please, don't say we need to protect Israel. There is no Israel. Today's Israel is a plant of the United Nations. It is not God's chosen people. As preterists, we should understand that. But, the so called Christians have been duped in to protecting what they think are God's chosen people. Therefore the Christians in America want our government to protect Israel from the Arab bullies. What's next? The destruction of the individual national currencies, which is happening now. Our congress and President is spending and spending. Meanwhile, the Federal Reserve, which is a bank under the International Monetary Fund, keeps flooding the American market with phony money. Just in my lifetime, gas per gallon went from 19 cents to between 4 and 5 dollars last year. Even now, it's approaching $3. I even remember a loaf of bread for 9 cents. The desruction of our economy has been happening for a hundred years. To explain that would take a lot of space, in an already lengthy post. I would like you to invite you to "My Political Forums." at www.sonofdavid.myfreeforum.orgSince the launch of Way of Truth, I didn't think I need two forum sites that were doing the same thing. So, the one at son of David was changed. Take care. |
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Post by Sower on Apr 10, 2010 17:04:17 GMT -5
Hi Didymus,
I think so! Although christians are in the world, but not of the world, Jesus told his disciples they were the salt of the earth (Matthew 5:13), and the light of the world (Matthew 5:14-14), therefore we should show forth the righteousness of Christ at every opportunity.
The Sower~
Sower~
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Post by MoGrace2U on Apr 10, 2010 17:39:12 GMT -5
Well Didy, you could also look at this way - that your time will be up soon and it will be your kids who fondly remember gas when it was only $5 a gallon...
When cigarettes were only $0.25 a pack it was half my lunch money - which is perhaps still relative - since now it is my whole lunch budget.
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Post by didymus on Apr 10, 2010 18:17:53 GMT -5
Robin, I don't have any children.  |
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Post by mellontes on Apr 10, 2010 20:21:05 GMT -5
Well Didy, you could also look at this way - that your time will be up soon and it will be your kids who fondly remember gas when it was only $5 a gallon... When cigarettes were only $0.25 a pack it was half my lunch money - which is perhaps still relative - since now it is my whole lunch budget. You should quit...  |
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Post by mellontes on Apr 10, 2010 20:32:31 GMT -5
Hi Didymus, I think so! Although christians are in the world, but not of the world, Jesus told his disciples they were the salt of the earth (Matthew 5:13), and the light of the world (Matthew 5:14-14), therefore we should show forth the righteousness of Christ at every opportunity. The Sower~ Sower~ The " world" is the old covenant world. The two covenants were in transition - the old being phased out and the being phased in... The "salt of the earth" is a reference to the "land." This is why the Jews were to be reached FIRST... Most take these references to be in relation to our surroundings - even in global terms. This perspective is continued with the idea of conformity: Romans 12:2 - And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. It was transformation from the old covenant that was wished. The law could not save not change people. Every reference to world (kosmos) in the NT has nothing to do with global terms or the general PRESENT non-Christian influence. Jesus was telling them not to be influenced with Judaism. Some would eventually fall back into Judaism to escape persecution...Some times "world" even corresponds with personal care and dress (and possibly even hairdos... see 1 Peter 3:3) |
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Post by didymus on Apr 10, 2010 21:32:07 GMT -5
Mell,
Could you answer the question without tearing apart what other people say?
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Post by didymus on Nov 13, 2010 9:16:04 GMT -5
Obviously Roo never saw this thread, so I bring it forward for his benefit. And, I do have a few more comments along these lines. Let me draw your attention to Romans 13.1-7: - NKJV; Biblegateway.com If the governing authorities are from God, why can't we have a real Christian in the White House? If Christians stay out of government, we know what kind of government we get. A government that steals people's money and call it taxes. A government that allows and supports abortion and homosexuality. A government that goes to war with no reason to do so, who also lies to take us to war. A government that allows people to be arrested for handing "Christian tracts" out in a Muslim neighborhood. A government that allows torture as a means of extracting information from so called "enemy combatants." A government that allows people to be arrested for speaking out against homosexuality. I'm sorry Roo, but this country is on the wrong track in every way. We need a true Christian in the White House to set a different tone in this country. We are headed down a road that will ultimately lead to a time when Christianity will be illegal, and Sharia law the law of the land. The little I know about Sharia law scares me. When Sharia law is adopted and codified in this country, then we will see the killing of Christians in this country. We are already seeing that in countries that have already adopted Sharia law. We must not allow that in this country. And it will happen if we remove Christians from the government. Is this what you want to see, Roo?  |
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Post by Once4all on Nov 13, 2010 14:12:18 GMT -5
But the passage you quoted (Romans 13:1-7) says, twice, that we are to be subject to the governing authorities, not to seek such authority.
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 13, 2010 15:38:43 GMT -5
Obviously Roo never saw this thread, so I bring it forward for his benefit. And, I do have a few more comments along these lines. Let me draw your attention to Romans 13.1-7: - NKJV; Biblegateway.com If the governing authorities are from God, why can't we have a real Christian in the White House? If Christians stay out of government, we know what kind of government we get. A government that steals people's money and call it taxes. A government that allows and supports abortion and homosexuality. A government that goes to war with no reason to do so, who also lies to take us to war. A government that allows people to be arrested for handing "Christian tracts" out in a Muslim neighborhood. A government that allows torture as a means of extracting information from so called "enemy combatants." A government that allows people to be arrested for speaking out against homosexuality. I'm sorry Roo, but this country is on the wrong track in every way. We need a true Christian in the White House to set a different tone in this country. We are headed down a road that will ultimately lead to a time when Christianity will be illegal, and Sharia law the law of the land. The little I know about Sharia law scares me. When Sharia law is adopted and codified in this country, then we will see the killing of Christians in this country. We are already seeing that in countries that have already adopted Sharia law. We must not allow that in this country. And it will happen if we remove Christians from the government. Is this what you want to see, Roo? Your question I bolded is an unfair. Of course I don't want to see such things. I said that the kingdom of God comes through the preaching of the gospel and not by force. Men need for the law of God to be written in their hearts. Roo |
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Post by didymus on Nov 13, 2010 22:15:59 GMT -5
Your question I bolded is an unfair. Of course I don't want to see such things. I said that the kingdom of God comes through the preaching of the gospel and not by force. Men need for the law of God to be written in their hearts. Roo I know. I was in one of those goofy facetious moods.  You're right it was an unfair question. |
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Post by Morris on Nov 15, 2010 14:33:17 GMT -5
I think that no matter what our job is we are to influence people for Christ and for good. So, if someone was to go into politics, it would be to influence people in politics for Christ and for good.
We are the messengers and are called to deliver the message wherever we may be. Paul desired to see King Agrippa become a Christian in Acts 26 and I don't doubt that Paul would also desire for him to remain in that office to be a witness to all those that Agrippa could influence for Christ, that others could not.
That's my view anyway.
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 15, 2010 15:50:11 GMT -5
Didy said:
The kingdom of God does not come by force. Why did the law of Moses fail? Answer: Because the law engraved in stone is ineffective if it is not written on the heart. A Christian in the White House cannot write the law on the heart.
You should know these things Didy.
Roo
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Post by didymus on Nov 16, 2010 14:49:18 GMT -5
Didy said: The kingdom of God does not come by force. Why did the law of Moses fail? Answer: Because the law engraved in stone is ineffective if it is not written on the heart. A Christian in the White House cannot write the law on the heart. You should know these things Didy. Roo Who said anything about using force? If a true Christian ran for President and is elected, that is not using force.  |
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Post by didymus on Nov 16, 2010 14:51:38 GMT -5
But the passage you quoted (Romans 13:1-7) says, twice, that we are to be subject to the governing authorities, not to seek such authority. Bev, We are to be subject to the governing authorities because..............? |
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 16, 2010 15:04:56 GMT -5
Didy said:
Yet Didy previously said:
In the first quote Didy said that he is not talking about force. But the second quote is clearly a contradiction.
The Crisis Pregnancy Centers are doing it God's way by preaching the gospel as well as helping women with 'crisis' pregnancies. Force is the method of the unbelieving.
Roo
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Post by Once4all on Nov 16, 2010 19:29:36 GMT -5
But the passage you quoted (Romans 13:1-7) says, twice, that we are to be subject to the governing authorities, not to seek such authority. Bev, We are to be subject to the governing authorities because..............? Because "there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God." So? |
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Post by didymus on Nov 17, 2010 4:35:52 GMT -5
Bev, We are to be subject to the governing authorities because..............? Because "there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God." So? So, since there is no authority except from God, is it outside the realm of possibility that God would appoint Christians to govern, or would He only appoint evil men? |
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 17, 2010 11:17:34 GMT -5
Didy said;
Christians have been appointed to be ambassadors for Christ. The title 'ambassador' by its very definition infers that we are non-citizens in this country.
Didy does not understand that we are pilgrims just passing through.
Roo
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Post by didymus on Nov 17, 2010 13:38:40 GMT -5
Didy said; Christians have been appointed to be ambassadors for Christ. The title 'ambassador' by its very definition infers that we are non-citizens in this country. Didy does not understand that we are pilgrims just passing through. Roo Sorry, I am not only a citizen of the kingdom of God, I am a citizen of the United States of America. Just as Paul was a citizen of the kingdom of God and a Roman citizen too. Romans 13 teaches that we should be good citizens. |
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 17, 2010 13:53:22 GMT -5
Didy said; Christians have been appointed to be ambassadors for Christ. The title 'ambassador' by its very definition infers that we are non-citizens in this country. Didy does not understand that we are pilgrims just passing through. Roo Sorry, I am not only a citizen of the kingdom of God, I am a citizen of the United States of America. Just as Paul was a citizen of the kingdom of God and a Roman citizen too. Romans 13 teaches that we should be good citizens. Paul the young Christian invoked his Roman citizenship. Paul the mature Christian said that he was a 'pilgrim' and an 'ambassador.' Both terms imply non-citizenship as in a foreign country. The latter is a representative of his home country. We're just passing through. Roo |
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Post by Morris on Nov 17, 2010 15:16:57 GMT -5
Paul the young Christian invoked his Roman citizenship. So did the older Paul. Being around sixty years old he appeals his case to Caesar as a citizen of Rome. |
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Post by Once4all on Nov 17, 2010 15:29:50 GMT -5
Because "there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God." So? So, since there is no authority except from God, is it outside the realm of possibility that God would appoint Christians to govern, or would He only appoint evil men? Does the authority established by God refer to the person occupying the office, or to the establishment of the office? I think the office and not the person, which is why a Hitler or a Saddam Hussein can occupy those offices. I disagree with Roo's claim that Paul invoked his Roman citizenship out of ignorance (the result of being young in the faith). According to the rules of the prevailing authority, Paul was a Roman citizen. Paul was simply being shrewd, using their own rules wisely. Matthew 10:16 NASB (16) "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves. Luke 16:9 NASB (9) "And I say to you, make friends for yourselves by means of the wealth of unrighteousness, so that when it fails, they will receive you into the eternal dwellings. |
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Post by didymus on Nov 17, 2010 17:56:32 GMT -5
Except for Roo's statements, I see no reason given here why a Christian can not run for President. |
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 17, 2010 18:00:20 GMT -5
Paul the young Christian invoked his Roman citizenship. So did the older Paul. Being around sixty years old he appeals his case to Caesar as a citizen of Rome. I was not referring to physical age when I said young christian, mature christian. Roo |
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Post by Allyn on Nov 17, 2010 18:47:35 GMT -5
Except for Roo's statements, I see no reason given here why a Christian can not run for President. The major problem as I see it why I would not want a Christian in the White House is that 99 % of all Christians today say Israel today is God's chosen and that means a contined constand battle over the land of Israel at the expense of innocents on both sides not to mention Palestinian Christians who are looked down upon and persecuted by Western Christians. |
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 17, 2010 20:33:38 GMT -5
Except for Roo's statements, I see no reason given here why a Christian can not run for President. The major problem as I see it why I would not want a Christian in the White House is that 99 % of all Christians today say Israel today is God's chosen and that means a contined constand battle over the land of Israel at the expense of innocents on both sides not to mention Palestinian Christians who are looked down upon and persecuted by Western Christians. My feelings exactly! Roo |
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Post by Allyn on Nov 17, 2010 20:42:42 GMT -5
The major problem as I see it why I would not want a Christian in the White House is that 99 % of all Christians today say Israel today is God's chosen and that means a contined constand battle over the land of Israel at the expense of innocents on both sides not to mention Palestinian Christians who are looked down upon and persecuted by Western Christians. My feelings exactly! Roo Even with my typos? But seriously this is a big problem. When the first Gulf War started there was near panic in many churches that the end was right at the door and then when Iraq sent in a couple or three scuds it was almost a certainty that Armageddon was sure to be next. Its things like this that give Christianity a bad name. |
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Post by kangaroojack on Nov 18, 2010 12:36:15 GMT -5
Even with my typos? But seriously this is a big problem. When the first Gulf War started there was near panic in many churches that the end was right at the door and then when Iraq sent in a couple or three scuds it was almost a certainty that Armageddon was sure to be next. Its things like this that give Christianity a bad name. At the risk of appearing unfair I must say that I believe the Dispensationalists are the culprits. Paul said that the gospel was supposed to make Israel jealous. But instead the Arabs have been made jealous for land. I am not saying that I believe that Israel today has any land promise. But the Dispensationalists say that they do and stick up for them to the point that the Arabs are not worthy of life for coveting the land when all the land promises to Israel were fulfilled. Am I making sense? Roo |
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Post by Allyn on Nov 18, 2010 16:57:11 GMT -5
Even with my typos? But seriously this is a big problem. When the first Gulf War started there was near panic in many churches that the end was right at the door and then when Iraq sent in a couple or three scuds it was almost a certainty that Armageddon was sure to be next. Its things like this that give Christianity a bad name. At the risk of appearing unfair I must say that I believe the Dispensationalists are the culprits. Paul said that the gospel was supposed to make Israel jealous. But instead the Arabs have been made jealous for land. I am not saying that I believe that Israel today has any land promise. But the Dispensationalists say that they do and stick up for them to the point that the Arabs are not worthy of life for coveting the land when all the land promises to Israel were fulfilled. Am I making sense? Roo Yes that makes sense. It is the Zionist/Dispensationalist and every tag along ism they may attract. |
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