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Post by mellontes on Sept 24, 2009 9:01:35 GMT -5
When was the law of God written on people's hearts?
To whom does this apply? Is it just Christians or to the unsaved as well?
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Post by MoGrace2U on Sept 24, 2009 11:21:43 GMT -5
I would say in the day Adam ate from the forbidden tree. There is no man who does not have a moral conscience that guides him in choosing what he considers right from wrong. Else how could he choose what seems right in his own eyes? Even a murderer however does not think it is right for another to kill him! Nor a thief, nor a liar, nor an adulterer. So the knowledge is there from the beginning right along with the perverseness of sin. Adam knew the goodness of God before the fall, and this knowledge would have passed to his sons even with the sin nature.
It is because this moral nature exists in all men that we can make an appeal for the standard of righteousness that God revealed in the gospel of Christ.
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Post by Allyn on Sept 24, 2009 11:38:36 GMT -5
Robin's answer seemed to be a good one and I don't think I could add to it. I believe that even though the Law of Moses was given to the children of Israel that it is applicable to all people (speaking of the 10 commandments). Jesus said that one law if observed took care of the rest and was called the greatest of the laws.
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Post by mellontes on Sept 24, 2009 20:33:41 GMT -5
Jeremiah 31:33 - But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Seems to me the writing of the law upon the hearts is still future to Jeremiah's time and is a covenant with the house of Israel...Don't get me wrong...I am not trying to be argumentative. It is just that I have heard so many versions of when this was to happen that I honestly don't know anymore or never did know - likely the last one...lol
Blessings,
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Post by Allyn on Sept 24, 2009 21:27:46 GMT -5
The continuation of the text says:
No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their
Steve Gregg has an excellent lecture on this at his website in the verse by verse section.
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Post by MoGrace2U on Sept 24, 2009 21:52:56 GMT -5
Just having the law upon one's heart (conscience) is only enough to bring conviction of sin (and a choice) - it brings no power to actually obey it. Which we see was the case with the Mosaic law - it could not actually make a man righteous because it could not perfect his conscience. I believe the new covenant promised in Jeremiah was to include the power now only to do what the law required (obedience) but also for that to be our innermost desire.
When Paul discusses the struggle that ensues between the desire to obey and the ability to do it (Rom 7), he ultimately points to Christ as the one who gives the victory in this struggle. There is no law written upon our hearts that is independent of that sanctifying work which is going on within.
Which is why covetousness is often used for the test of whether a heart has been converted or not. A heart made generous need not try and justify itself like Ananias and Sapphira did - instead it flows 'naturally' with no guile. Simon the sorcerer is the other negative example. And Zaccheaus is the positive example.
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Post by Once4all on Sept 24, 2009 22:35:43 GMT -5
Jeremiah 31:33 - But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. Seems to me the writing of the law upon the hearts is still future to Jeremiah's time and is a covenant with the house of Israel...Don't get me wrong...I am not trying to be argumentative. It is just that I have heard so many versions of when this was to happen that I honestly don't know anymore or never did know - likely the last one...lol
Blessings,
I agree with you. Notice Proverbs 3:3 instructs the reader to write God's commandments "on the tablet of your heart." (Also Proverbs 7:3) Do not let kindness and truth leave you; Bind them around your neck, Write them on the tablet of your heart. (Proverbs 3:3 NASB) But as part of the new covenant, God says that HE will write His law on our hearts: "But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days," declares the LORD, " I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. (Jeremiah 31:33 NASB) " They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them," declares the LORD, "for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more." (Jeremiah 31:34 NASB) Obviously, this does not refer to ALL people, but only those who are bound by the new covenant... those who are part of the church. I believe that God writing his law on our hearts refers to receiving the Holy Spirit. Bev |
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Post by mellontes on Sept 25, 2009 6:31:21 GMT -5
Interesting comments...can we get a little more specific as to the WHEN?
For many, the when has not happened yet (dispensationalists) because they do not believe this new covenant is in force as yet, but will be one day with the nation of Israel...to cite just one example of the WHEN issue...
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Post by MoGrace2U on Sept 25, 2009 12:59:25 GMT -5
I would think the appearance of tongues and the gift of prophesy which appeared at Pentecost marked the beginning of 'when'. In contrast we see the Pharisees unable to make a right judgment call as concerns the law. John makes a particular note of this by recording the things Jesus did on the Sabbath for which they accused Him of breaking the law. Also the epistles continue to apply the law in the apostle's new understanding, as Jesus had. Giving a fuller meaning to both the law and the prophets.
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Post by Once4all on Sept 25, 2009 15:29:48 GMT -5
My final comment, equating the law written on our hearts with the receiving of the Holy Spirit, could point to Pentecost, but not necessarily. The pouring out of the Spirit at Pentecost definitely signified the last days. However, that "pouring out" is not necessarily the same as "receiving the Spirit."
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Post by mellontes on Sept 28, 2009 7:22:22 GMT -5
It would seem then that this (the writing of the law upon their hearts) would be indicative of the "change" that the apostles wrote of, especially Paul's epistles to the Corinthians (1 Cor 15:51-52, 2 Cor 3:18) and possibly having inference to Hebrews 7:12 ...agree? disagree? I also tend to agree that the old supposed "rapture" text of Thessalonians has implications toward this idea as well.
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Post by Once4all on Sept 28, 2009 13:24:54 GMT -5
1 Corinthians 15:51-52 seems quite different from 2 Corinthians 3:18. One speaks of change "in the twinkling of an eye" and the other would seem to be a more ongoing process, "being transformed."
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Post by mellontes on Sept 29, 2009 9:27:49 GMT -5
1 Corinthians 15:51-52 seems quite different from 2 Corinthians 3:18. One speaks of change "in the twinkling of an eye" and the other would seem to be a more ongoing process, "being transformed." Perhaps...but are there then two "changes"? I don't see the subject matter changing here, but then again I might be wrong. |
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