Ongoing Judgment?

[Once4all]

What is the scriptural support, if any, for a continued or ongoing judgment of people after 70 A.D.?

I believe we are judged when we die, but why do I believe this?

Thanks.

Bev

[MoGrace2U]

Hi Bev,
You asked a good one! A topic which doesn't get much press either. I don't have a particular scriptural response (big surprise) but from what I have gathered so far, I don't think anybody but OT Israel was facing a sheep/ goats type of judgment at the 1st resurrection. And perhaps some OT Gentiles who believed God. I believe the NT saints are judged in this life thru the chastening of the Lord and at death receive their reward(s), which may have some loss because of fruitless works. There seems to be a clear judgment specified for both the just and the unjust. Which Israel automatically assumed they were the 'just' and the Gentiles the unjust. But the example given regarding Nineveh who repented, would seem to refute that, because they would testify against Israel.

It was only OT Israel who had not yet been justified for their sins by the blood of Christ, yet who had a testimony of faith in God which looked forward to Christ - like Abraham. Esau would be an example of one who was deemed unjust because he forsook his birthright which was to be among the fathers who brought forth Christ. And though he was judged in this life, he was still blessed by Isaac - but cut off from the promise. I think that makes him a goat but I am not sure.

If there is universal salvation at all in scripture, I think it must concern true Israel only. As for the wicked, I don't think they get resurrected at all but are judged in their death. When the wrath of God is sent upon a people, that would seem to be their judgment at that time. But for those whose works had not been tested - note neither the sheep & goats had known that they served the brethren of Christ or not - this still had to be determined FOR their salvation. That cannot be NT saints.

It could however be true for nominal Christians or false professors. Which would put them in the group with the rest of the dead - those not justified because they had not been born again and yet confessed Christ. Heck even the cults could be there. But those who specifically denied Christ in this life I don't think rise at all.

There is a glimmer of hope even in the judgment for those who face it. So unless salvation is based on works instead of faith, I think the judgment only applies to those confessing faith in God. That leaves the Hindus, atheists and other idolators dead in their graves. And post cross, those wicked might even include ones who call themselves Jews but who are not because they deny Christ.

Let me know if you find any good articles on the topic.

[mellontes]

Apr 4, 2009 16:40:54 GMT -5 Once4all said:

What is the scriptural support, if any, for a continued or ongoing judgment of people after 70 A.D.?

I believe we are judged when we die, but why do I believe this?

Thanks.

Bev

Here's my two worthless cents...

I don't believe in rewards for the believer at death. And if there are they certainly are not degrees of life in heaven - something I was taught for a long time. When we die we go to be with the Lord. Period.

I believe we no longer are condemned as believers, since it is only Christ who God sees in us. Therefore, no judgment of believers. The judgment is passed.

Not popular views in preterism...but if Rev 1:1 and Rev 1:3 are not true, then just about anything goes.

[Once4all]

Thanks both of you, very much, for your replies. I hate to say it, but I don't agree with either of you. I do agree that there is no universal salvation. I do not agree with OSAS, but don't want to get into a debate here about it.

My concern was for something in scripture that gave a clue about future (to 70 AD) believers.

One possibility is this passage in Revelation 21, which is stated AFTER the judgment of Revelation 20:

Revelation 21:6-8 NASB
(6) Then He said to me, "It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give to the one who thirsts from the spring of the water of life without cost.
(7) "He who overcomes will inherit these things, and I will be his God and he will be My son.
(8) "But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."

So after THE Judgement, there is still the opportunity to overcome the world and be a child of God. And for those who don't, there is still the lake of fire.

I guess I've answered my own question!

Bev